Creating Wholesome Natural Products for Body, Mind, and Spirit – Daisy Kimbro and Aromaology

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Hey there, entrepreneurs. My name is Sushant and welcome to Trep Talks. This is the show where I interview successful eCommerce entrepreneurs, executive and thought leader, and ask them questions about their business. And also dive deep into some of the strategies and tactics that they have used to start grow their businesses.

And today I’m really excited to welcome Daisy Kimbro to the show Daisy. Daisy is the founder of a company called Aroma. Aroma is an all natural bath body and home fragrance products company. And today I’m going to ask Daisy a few questions about her preneur journey and some of the strategy tactics that she has used to start to grow her business.

So thank you so much for joining me today. 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Really appreciate. Thank you for a having me. I’m grateful for the opportunity. So yeah, I 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: mean, um, we can get right into your story, your entrepreneurial story. Uh, what motivated you to start with business Aroma, my what is business about, what are your products?

How are you helping people, and what really you into 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: starting this. Well, I started making the products as a hobby, candles for myself, and then a friend of mine, several people that I started giving them the products away to as gifts, really loved it and told me, you have to do something with this. I had no intentions on.

Starting a business at that time, but I was so overwhelmed with the feedback that I got from everyone that loved the products and kept ordering. And so I said, maybe I’m onto something. And so I, um, a girlfriend of Mines who had wrote a book and was doing, A show, a expo, and wanted me to share a booth with her, and I kept saying, no, I’m not interested.

She kept telling me, you have to do this, Daisy. I’m not gonna stop bugging you about this. I’m gonna come knock on your door every day. She came and knocked on my door every day for two weeks, so I got tired of her. I said, Leave me alone. I’ll go ahead and sign up and share a booth with you. And the event was three days.

I sold out the first day. That’s when I knew I was onto something. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: So what is, what is unique about these products? Because to me, I mean, as a man, When I look at these beauty products, I, I’m thinking, you know, there’s, there’s so many beauty products out there and you know, on your website you have body oil, body scrubs, body butter, and you know, all these different beauty products.

Um, what makes your product different? Like, what do you think you really tapped into when. You kind of sold out all your products on the first day. What, what did the customers like about 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: your products? They love the scent, the smell. Um, I constantly get told they’ve never smelled anything like this and it’s so good at moisturizing to your skin and the sit stays all day.

When you put it on the body oils, the body butters. That’s what my customers, um, told me on a tell me on a regular basis about how they love that. The sense are pretty amazing. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: And uh, and are these products, I’m assuming, are mostly used by women or are some products more for men also? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Um, most, I have both men and women.

I have a men’s line of products as well. Um, but the majority are women. Okay. And. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: So when you started, I’m assuming when you went to this expo, did you start selling it like in person first and then at a certain point you realized there’s a market for it and so you’ve created e-commerce website, or how did that actually 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: start for you?

Well, yeah, after the, um, the expo. My dentist that I worked for in Beverly Hills, I was working full-time at that time. Um, found out what I was doing cuz I had to take time off from work to do this. And once I told her about and showed her the products, she started selling them in the dental office for me.

Okay. And so that’s when it started picking up steam because I had celebrities buying the products of, in the dental office in Beverly Hills, we saw a lot of celebrities and so they started buying it and it just took off from there. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: And then you, you thought, uh, that this would do better on an e-commerce website.

At what point did you start the, the website? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Well after, um, I started selling ’em in the dental office. I was doing it part-time and several opportunities kept transpiring, but because I was working full time, I wasn’t able to fulfill the need. Um, so after probably about a year I developed the e-commerce website.

No, first I developed, I’m on Etsy. Are you familiar with et? I am. Yes, it’s the market. Okay, so first I started on Etsy and I did pretty well. And after I had Etsy, I thought about developing the the website. And so I did that and that was very successful. But most of my success has been on Etsy. Okay. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Even, even now, it’s most of your business, so is on Etsy.

And you don’t sell on Amazon. 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: I don’t sell on Amazon. I sell on Etsy. I sell on Wayfair. There’s different platforms I do sell on, but my biggest seller is Etsy. Okay. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: And so originally you basically are, were formulating these products. What, in your own, uh, home, in your own kitchen, and as you’ve grown, how has your manufacturing changed?

Are you still creating your own products or is this something that you know, you’re getting help from other people or other companies that are creating your 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: products? Um, no, I, I hand, I, I formulated all of my product. And I hand make them. I wanna keep the integrity of my products because I’ve heard so many times when you go to big manufacturers to make the product for you, it loses some of its integrity and components.

So I didn’t want that to happen. So I continually make my products. I have family members and friends that help me as well. But my goal is to hand make it. I also had, um, big, um, investor who came to me and wanted to invest in my products. I would’ve been in Costco, I would’ve been in all these major stores, but they wanted me to manufacture in China.

Okay? And so I didn’t wanna do, And so I turned down the deal because I felt like if I went to China, first of all, the manufacturers were telling me my ingredients I use are too high quality and it wouldn’t be profitable for them to manufacture. They wanted to cut a lot of my ingredients, so basically that’s why I turned the offer.

Okay. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: So yeah, I, I think that that’s a very interesting thing because some people or some businesses may have taken those opportunities, but I think every business is different and every business or business owner has different goals. And for you, you know, retaining the quality was important to be able to give the best quality to your customers.

Um, so you’re not, you’re not in any retail stores right now because you didn’t, just didn’t pursue that. 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: I am in some small boutique stores. Um, but as far as big box retail stores, I’m not currently in. Okay. That’s a goal of mine. That is a goal of mines, you know, somewhere down the future. But right now I’m in several retail stores, boutiques across the country.

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: So, you know, in any entrepreneur when they’re starting out, you. Initial investment is always, uh, a big challenge. Or you know, it’s a big question, you know, how much money should I invest in, in my business and my startup because it’s, it’s a bit risky cause you dunno if your business is gonna succeed. Uh, for you, it seemed like you were already working.

Um, so can you share a little bit about, you know, what, what was that like for you, uh, in terms of making the investment and how did you, what was the initial investment you had to make? Um, and was it a significant one? And how did you do that? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Well, I initially invested around $10,000 to get started and I wanted to start off slow and gradually build.

And so, um, I would say after about six months, I saw that it was profitable for me. And so, um, I kept going and kept, of course, you know, the more, the bigger you grow, the more you have to invest. Um, so I just constantly am, and with most companies, you have to always keep, um, investing and. In order to grow.

And so, um, over time I knew that would, it would be profitable for me to continue to invest. And it, of course, you know, sometimes you have some failures in business, but that didn’t stop me. Um, I knew I would, could overcome any obstacles that came in my way. And so I just kept going no matter what obstacles I had to deal.

Okay. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: And did you, are you still working full-time or did have you, like at a certain point, you know, your, the money that you were getting out of your business was. Significant enough that you said, okay, let me focus a hundred percent of my time on my business. Uh, cause it’s not, not worth it to, to be doing both things, or, or are you still working full time?

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: No, I am, I’m full time with theology. I no longer work in the dental office. I woke up, everyone thought I was crazy. I woke up one day and said, I’m going in and quitting my job today. Scared and excited at the same time, but I still did it. I gave my two weeks notice. Um, I jumped off the cliff because, you know, I just came up with, I felt like I needed to do this here.

I’m investing all this time and energy being gone from home. Like 15 hours a day, there’s no way I could continue to build the way I want to and to grow the company. So I made a decision to give my two weeks notice and to do it full time. Probably the hardest thing in my life I’ve ever done. It was really hard, but I, no matter what, I felt like this was my baby that I birthed and I’m not gonna ever quit.

I’m never gonna stop. And I didn’t, and it has paid off well, I think. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: I think that’s awesome. I mean, I guess there’s two things there, right? Number one, you probably intuitively knew that at a certain point that yes, this is working. And if I focus a hundred percent of my time, I grow. Like, so you probably at a certain point you go that confidence.

And then number two, it’s always like, you know, when you’re building your own business, um, and you’re quitting your job, I mean, you’re building your skills, right? So you can always, if things don’t work out in the business, you can always go back, find another job. So I think a lot of the time for entrepreneurs, um, There is, there is a certain risk and people, entrepreneurs feel the fear of quitting the job and, and, you know, quitting that, uh, biweekly pay or weekly pay, whatever, its, but, uh, but ultimately I don’t think there’s anything to entrepreneurship when you’re on the journey.

You learning so much that you have, so skills you can contribute and you can find job really, really easily.

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Yeah, I, I thought I said, you know, because when all my families and friends were asking me, are you sure you wanna do this? You have a great job and you work with great people and you love what you do. I said, yeah, I can always go back and find another job if it doesn’t work out. But I’m not, because I am going to make this work.

I don’t have a, I didn’t have a plan B because I was adamant on making. This work. That’s, 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: that’s awesome. So you said that your primary sales channel is Etsy. Um, have you learned anything about your target market? Like who, what is the kinda person who actually buys these products? And do you, do you think about how to diversify your sales channel?

Because, you know, you, if you. Depending too much on one place to, you know, which is your main source of sales. Mm-hmm. , it actually, it actually makes some changes to their business or something happens, you know, maybe they’re acquired by a different company and they decide to do something. Basically you are, you, you do your business overnight, or you lead to significant portion of your business.

I know you’ve created your website also as a, as a way to diversify that, but what kinda effort do you. In growing your business to your own website versus Etsy and, and how do you, how do you think about this, uh, this thing? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Well, Etsy, my, uh, Customer based is urban. Um, ages young professionals, women ages is between 18 and 29.

Buy the most beauty products. So I al, I have that group of people that buy from me, but I also have new mothers and women 65 and up who purchased. From me or my demographics, but, and Etsy, it, I became successful on Etsy because I was featured as the editors picked, and so they put me on the front page of Etsy, and when they did that, my sales on Etsy at one time increased 89000%.

My sales went through the roof. So Etsy has been a godsend for me because, um, that’s why I’m so successful is because of Etsy. I do have my website and I often think about what if Etsy went. Hmm. What will I do? Hmm. I do, I get many of sales on my website. I have my wholesale accounts. I have fair, I have different platforms that I’m on.

So I know if Etsy went away, if that was my, if it was taken away from me, I still. Would be able to manage and be successful. It was just that I would take that energy and time away from Etsy and put it into my other platforms that I’m on and my website. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Okay. So you mentioned Faire and I believe is kind of like this, uh, wholesale distribution benefit channel.

Yes. Um, is, is that a big channel for you? How do you, how do you. Do you do anything to grow it or Mostly organic? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: It’s organic. Um, it is a wholesale website where stores come to you and make purchases to put in their stores, and so I’ve probably have received orders from about 20 different stores, so that has.

I would say behind ET C is number one. Two is my website, and number three would be fair. Okay. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Which, which of your products are you most proud of? Like, which products are your best 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: sellers? Oh, my best sellers are my body butters, my candles, my body oils, and my diffusers. Those are my top four sellers. I also have created mindfulness boxes, uh, a meditation box, a manifestation box, and those have also taken off.

I only sell those on Etsy, so I’ve been very successful with that. Those as well. But my main, but my main ones are the body oils. Body butters, the candles, and diffuse. Those are my app sellers. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Are you spending a lot of, uh, time and effort on marketing, uh, right now? Do you use, like what kind of marketing do you use?

Do you use like social media ads so forth, or is it mostly really uh, driven organic? Right now 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: it is both organic and social media. Those two are the only. Marketing I use. So pretty much my product sell itself. And not only that, my reviews, I have great reviews. I get probably have like 1,805 star reviews, so that also adds into, um, my marketing as well.

But no, it’s mostly organic and also social media. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: So why not? Why not Amazon? Do you think? Because Amazon has, has such a, such a huge market or customer base, if you put it there and utilize, uh, you know, of course it seems like the quality of product speaks for itself. So don’t you think that if you put, if you go on Amazon, that you know you can get an additional source of revenue?

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Yes, I have been approached, Amazon has come to me asking me to sell my products from their platform. I just haven’t done it yet. It takes a lot of time, energy, and effort in putting it together. So I, my plan is to eventually to sell on Amazon, but right now, I don’t, I, I’m not focused on that. Maybe, probably.

Cause after the holidays it kind of slows down for me. So during that time, after January of next year, I will, um, inquire about selling my products on Amazon. But right now I just don’t have the time to set it all up. Takes a lot to set. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Okay. Um, the other thing I’m, I’m very interested in knowing, I mean, you’ve definitely created a good brand.

I mean, you know, you have a great name, uh, business name, uh, and good packaging, good design. How, can you talk a little bit about, you know, what was the process? Did you do, did you come up with all of this thing on your own? Did you get help from other people? Um, in terms of branding your. 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: I pretty much did it all myself.

Came up with the concept. I knew I wanted to be natural. Have the, the look of that it’s natural, so that’s why I went with the natural looking labels and the containers and the packaging, and I used sustainable packaging. Um, my goal was to create a brand that not only speaks, that is natural, but also my ingredients are also natural.

So I wanted to be cohesive in that area, and so I came up with the, in the beginning, my, my labels and packaging. Has evolved from where you, when I started, and I’m happy with where it’s at right now. I get a lot of good feedback on my branding, so I do plan to, um, do some tweaking to, you know, make it more, uh, pleasing.

to my customers, upgrade my packaging a little more and my labels. And so it, that will probably happen next year as well. So how 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: did you learn to create all these products? Like did you, did you want what? YouTube videos. Did you read a book? Like how did you learn to create these products? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: No, I didn’t do YouTube.

I didn’t do. I pretty much did research because at first I made my first product in 1998. Okay. And that was a candle. And then I also wanted to create a body, but the body butter. So I did a lot of research on. Um, ingredients that will be natural and organic for your skin and, and will help with, you know, any conditions that wouldn’t irritate the skin.

And I want it to be non-toxic, so. I researched she butter. It wasn’t popular back in 1998 and it wasn’t, you could, didn’t have easy access to it either, but I did find it and I started playing with it because a lot at that time, a lot of companies were buying the base and just add the fragrance to create the body butter.

But I wanted to create my base, so. It was a lot of experimenting, trial and errors. It took me two years to finally get down my formula for the body butters, and so I’m very happy with it. I’m getting great, um, feedback on it. And yeah, it, it was a lot of work, , and it took a lot of time, but I finally mastered.

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: That’s good. I mean, you’re, you’re then, then you’re truly an innovator. I mean, in terms of really taking the time to, to learn about it and, you know, create something that, that works and you know that that’s your own, so that, that’s, that’s really what innovation is. Are you selling mostly in US right now, or are you selling an international market?

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Um, I have customers all over the world, uk, Canada, um, Dubai, um, just all over. I get customers, China, um, Hawaii, I mean all over. I can, so, 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: so people can buy easily through Etsy. And how do you ship it out then? Like, Do you use your own shipping, uh, shipping company to ship it out, or is it shipped out through like a different warehouse?

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: No, I use, um, I use either UPS or I use, I use FedEx slightly, but my, the majority of my orders are shipped through U S P S 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: S P. Okay. Hmm. Yes. And. If somebody is living in internationally, is it like the timeframe that it takes for the package to get there is reasonable? Like they don’t complain about getting it, uh, you know, like after 30 days or something With the US 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: ps No.

With ups, they’re pretty quick. I haven’t had any complaints from my international customers. I would say they, their order arise no later than one week. Cool. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Uh, what does your team look like right now? Is it, um, how many people are you, uh, employing? How many people are you 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: working with right now? Well, I have myself.

I have my daughter who is like my assistant and my organizer cuz she keeps everything flowing and together. Then I have my, uh, of course accountant, um, that keeps me on track on my profit and loss and everything. Um, then I also have my team that helps with. The packaging, I mean, not the packaging shipping that ships packages and, and fulfills the orders and ship ’em out.

I don’t have to go and deliver and to take it to the post office. They come and pick up from me every day. Okay. So that’s pretty much what my team is entails. I also have, um, my. Team who helps with, you know, if I wanted to, when I create a new project, a product, and, um, and I need to create a, a label or, or also my social media, because that takes a lot with graphics and, and marketing and they help with that.

So that’s pretty much what my, I’m sorry. Yeah. Mm-hmm. . That’s pretty much who my team is. . 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Okay, so what does, what does future look like for you, for your business? Do you want continue just keeping on the same kind, um, business model where you’re creating the product, getting orders from ET Or do you have years?

The road, 10 year round of the road, your vision for business is a little bit different where you are a much bigger business? You know, more employees and you are kind of like, uh, you know, CEO and more of the man people managing or, you know, the big ideas, uh, kind of person or, or you want to keep it small.

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: No, I wanna keep growing to, I wanna take it. The possibilities are endless and I wanna take advantage of every opportunity. So of course, you know, you can only do so much at one time. So little by little I plan on, I have a timeline of. What I want to do at a certain point, my one year goal, my five year goal, my 10 year goal, I have plans.

I’ve been approached by Wayfair. There’s a department store here in Atlanta called Belts, so I can only do so much. I take it one by one and. I would love to be one day, be a household name. So that’s my goal is to keep expanding and keep growing, and who knows, eventually, possibly even having my own brick and martyr.

Okay, 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: that makes sense. So in every entrepreneur’s journey, there’s always mistakes made, lessons learned, failure. Uh, in your journey, uh, what have been some big mistakes, like one big mistake that you think, uh, you know, could, would’ve killed your business or something like that. What did you learn from it?

What can other entrepreneurs learn from your mistakes? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Oh, I made many mistakes. , , I made mistakes as far as, um, Especially when my business increased 89000%. That’s when I learned a lot of lessons as far as shipping. Um, because a lot of my orders, some of them, not all, but some of them, We’re broken in, in the interim of shipping to the customer or the product leaked out, so I learned to better, to select better packaging and ordering better materials for the shipping.

But yeah, that was probably my biggest mistake was when I was, all of a sudden I’m hit with all these orders and not used to, um, shipping on that larger scale. So I had to step back and to do some research and find the correct boxes, the correct materials that will keep. Products from leaking or breaking.

And so that was my biggest lesson at 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: uh, now we’re gonna move on our rapid fire segment. And in this segment I’m gonna ask you a few quick questions. And you have to them 1 1 2 words or you know, a sentence or so. The first one is one book. One book that you would recommend to entrepreneurs or business professionals and.

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Um, I have so many books cuz I read on a regular basis, um, because I feel that in order to grow your company you have to grow yourself as well. And so, The person that I am now will not be the person that I want to be or where I want my customer to be. But I believe the one of the books that really helped me in success would be the, I don’t know if you ever heard of the 5:00 AM Club?

Uh, 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: yeah, I have, yeah. 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Bob and Sharma. Yes, I would recommend that book because it changed my life. When you create, you have to have a routine, a morning routine to, to jumpstart your day, and so, you know. He talks about get up in the morning. First thing you do is move and exercise you. Be grateful. Have a grateful journey.

Write down things you’re grateful for because it will attract more things to you that you want. Pray. Plan, constantly learned and read daily, and so that book helped me. I do, I’ve been doing this routine of minds for, it’s called the 20 20 20 Formula, where it’s 20 minutes of learning, 20 minutes of exercise, and 20 minutes of planning.

And so that pretty much shapes my whole day. I planned the night before of what I have to do today and. That book actually helped me go into, 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Hmm. Do you, do you wake up at five? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: I do. Okay. Yes. Mm-hmm. , it was a habit. It wasn’t hard for me to do because when I worked at, at the dental office for 13 years, I woke up at 4:00 AM Okay, so 5:00 AM is not, wasn’t it is just automatic.

Really. Okay. Uh, 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: and innovative product or idea in the current e-commerce retailer tech landscape that you feel 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: excited. I didn’t hear you. What was that again? Uh, a 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: product or idea that you feel excited about? Uh, it could be related to e-commerce, retail, or technology. 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Oh, a product that I’m excited about.

Not my product, but 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: yeah. Any other product that you, you like 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: to use? Oh, wow. Well, that’s, I, let’s. Hmm, there are so many. I would say books because I’m an avid reader, so I know that’s not really a product, but I’d love to read and I love books, and so, 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: and you read hard copy or you read it like on your iPad or, or, or Kindle or something like that.

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Well, I read both audio books on Audible and I also read hard. You know, I like to feel the books also. So I read both. I mean, I listen to audio like while I’m working and I also read a lot on, I listen a lot on YouTube to books and, and motivational speakers and, um, so. Absolutely. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: There you go. I mean, that’s, that’s, it’s audible and I guess, you know, that’s the product that you use.

Yes. In, in addition to hard copy, um, a business or productivity tool or software that you would recommend or a productivity tip, 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: A business software that I use 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Or productivity or, or tip for productivity. 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Um, for productivity. I pretty much, I have created my own system as far as productivity on um, Excel, and that’s how I keep track of all of my goods, my sales, um, my vendors.

I pretty much created because I’ve researched and it wasn’t anything that fit what I needed, so I created my own. Okay. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Uh, an entrepreneur or business person whom you look up to or someone who inspired you? 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Oh, well, I will say who really inspired me was my mom and my grandmother. They were both entrepreneurs.

My grandmother had her own daycare center and my mom was a hairstylist, and they pretty much instilled those principles in me because on the weekends when I wasn’t in school, I had to work in my. Hair salon. And then during the summers I worked in at my grandmother’s daycare. So they pretty much gave me the entrepreneurship skills, and I believe that’s why I’m here today is because of them.

Okay, 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: and final question, best business advice you ever received or you would give to other. 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: The best advice I received and that I will give to any entrepreneur out there is that failure is a part of the plan of success. You’re gonna fail, but you don’t really fail unless you quit. I look at failure as a, a means of a new direction.

The, the path that you are on is not working, so you have to venture off in another direction, but as long as you don’t give up, you won’t fail. It will. It always works out. It may be a difficult time, but you look at those failures as an opportunity to grow yourself and to learn from the mistakes you made, and you will be successful as long as you don’t give up.

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Perfect. That’s a great advice. So Dave, thank you so much. Those were all the questions that I had. Um, really want to thank you for your time today for sharing your, uh, business story, entrepreneurship story, how you, uh, grew your business or the challenges that you face. Um, if someone wants watching this interview, once your product, what if the best way they can, they can.

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: Taking purchase on Etsy is etsy.com/aroma or, or you can just look at, go on Etsy and Research Aroma and I will pop up, or my website is Dave leads aroma dot. 

Sushant Misra of TrepTalks: Awesome. Well, Des thank you so much again. Really, really appreciate um, your time and sharing your story. So joining me, 

Daisy Kimbro of Aromaology: I appreciate you. Thank you for having me.